Simboli i shqiponjës me dy koka në flamurin tonë kombëtar

[land]

Po me kujton nja dy zhurmues me te cilet jam hasur ne disa postime te tjera. Ke te njejtin stil.

Ajo qe ke nxjerre ti flet per nje periudhe tjeter shume te vonshme o "i ndritur". Edhe skenderbeu quhej nga papa Zot i epiroteve ne nje kohe qe sllavet quheshin ilire po kjo sdo te thote qe sllavet jane me te vertete pasardhes te ilireve dhe ne pasardhes te epiroteve.

Nje fjale e urte thote: ruhu nga ai qe ka lexuar vetem nje liber. Eshte fjala per ty.

Lexo pak me shume nga studimet moderne e mos na sill ketu shkrimet e lashta.

Cfare??? Pirro Re dell" Albania eshte i kohes se vonshme???
Nuk e dija qe je dhe qorr, sorry.

Thucydides perjashton epirotet nga helenet.

The Hellenic troops with him consisted of the Ambraciots, Leucadians, and Anactorians, and the thousand Peloponnesians with whom he came; the barbarian of a thousand Chaonians, who, belonging to a nation that has no king, were led by Photius and Nicanor, the two members of the royal family to whom the chieftainship for that year had been confided. With the Chaonians came also some Thesprotians, like them without a king, some Molossians and Atintanians led by Sabylinthus, the guardian of king Tharyps who was still a minor, and some Paravaeans, under their King Oroedus, accompanied by a thousand Orestians, subjects of King Antiochus and placed by him under the command of Oroedus. There were also a thousand Macedonians sent by Perdiccas without the knowledge of the Athenians, but they arrived too late.

kurse Appiani i klasifikon epirotet brenda ilireve

The Greeks call those people Illyrians who occupy the region beyond Macedonia and Thrace from Chaonia and Thesprotia to the river Ister (Danube). This is the length of the country. Its breadth is from Macedonia and the mountains of Thrace to Pannonia and the Adriatic and the foot-hills of the Alps. Its breadth is five days' journey and its length thirty -- so the Greek writers say. The Romans measured the country and found its length to be upward of 6000 stades and its width about 1200

PS.shih nje foto tjeter

[land]

Ne tekst flitet per Pellazget, nje popull mitik per te cilin nuk ka absolutisht as edhe nje prove te vetme rreth ekzistences se tyre.

Herodotus (I, 57-58.)

The Pelasgi, on the other hand, were, as I think, a barbarian race which never greatly multiplied.

Pra ishin barbare, jo helene.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Strabo 5.2.4

As for the Pelasgi, almost all agree, in the first place, that some ancient tribe of that name spread throughout the whole of Greece, and particularly among the Aeolians of Thessaly. Again, Ephorus says that he is of the opinion that, since they were originally Arcadians, they chose a military life, and that, in converting many peoples to the same mode of life, they imparted their name to all, and thus acquired great glory, not only among the Greeks, but also among all other people whithersoever they had chanced to come. For example, they prove to have been colonisers of Crete, as Homer says; at any rate, Odysseus says to Penelope: "But one tongue with others is mixed; there dwell Achaeans, there Cretans of the old stock, proud of heart, there Cydonians and Dorians too, of waving plumes, and goodly Pelasgians." And Thessaly is called "the Pelasgian Argos" (I mean that part of it which lies between the outlets of the Peneius River and Thermopylae as far as the mountainous country of Pindus), on account of the fact that the Pelasgi extended their rule over these regions. Further, the Dodonaean Zeus is by the poet himself named "Pelasgian": "O Lord Zeus, Dodonaean, Pelasgian." And many have called also the tribes of Epirus "Pelasgian," because in their opinion the Pelasgi extended their rule even as far as that. And, further, because many of the heroes were called "Pelasgi" by name, the people of later times have, from those heroes, applied the name to many of the tribes; for example, they have called the island of Lesbos "Pelasgia," and Homer has called "Pelasgi" the people that were neighbours to those Cilicians who lived in the Troad: "And Hippothous led the tribes of spear-fighting Pelasgi, those Pelasgi who inhabited deep-soiled Larissa." But Ephorus' authority for the statement that this race originated in Arcadia was Hesiod; for Hesiod says: "And sons were born of god-like Lycaon, who, on a time, was begotten by Pelasgus." Again, Aeschylus, in his Suppliants, or else his Danaan Women, says that the race of the Pelasgi originated in that Argos which is round about Mycenae. And the Peloponnesus too, according to Ephorus, was called "Pelasgia." And Euripides too, in his Archelaus, says: "Danaus, the father of fifty daughters, on coming into Argos, took up his abode in the city of Inachus, and throughout Greece he laid down a law that all people hitherto named Pelasgians were to be called Danaans." And again, Anticleides says that they were the first to settle the regions round about Lemnos and Imbros, and indeed that some of these sailed away to Italy with Tyrrhenus the son of Atys. And the compilers of the histories of The Land of Atthis give accounts of the Pelasgi, believing that the Pelasgi were in fact at Athens too, although the Pelasgi were by the Attic people called "Pelargi," the compilers add, because they were wanderers and, like birds, resorted to those places whither chance led them.


Ps.Vazhdo akoma si derri ne lluc....lol

[_Mersin_]

Ketu po nxitohesh pak o Mersin.

Perandoria osmane nuk kishte nje flamur te vetem shteteror ndersa flamuri i sotshem i Turqise eshte adoptuar ne 1844, 400 vjet pas Skenderbeut.

Ngjyre te kuqe ka edhe flamuri i Malit te zi, megjithate ngjyra e kuqe nuk ka asnje lidhje me flamurin e Turqise.

Shqiponja qe mbante Skenderbeu ishte shqiponja e familjes se Kastrioteve, embleme e perdorur qe para se Skenderbeu te lindte.

Para se te debatoni e te argumentoni per shqiponjen e Skenderbeut, beni mire qe te merrni informacion per flamuret e princave te tjere qe qarkullonin ne ate periudhe. Do te qartesoheni per shume gjera.

Politika shoviniste sllave ka qene shume e forte ne Shqiperi, Flamuri Serb, Flamuri Rus dhe Flamuri Shqiptar i perngjajne me shume flamujve bizantin sepse po te shikosh flamuret me latin nuk kane dy koka ne shqiponje por nje.

[_Mersin_]

psh ketu tregohet flamuri qe kane perdorur shqiptaret ne pritjen e trupoave austro-Hungareze

[Fleur Blanche]

mesues i marksizmit mos genje kaq trashe.

e.p, mos ia ve re, se keshtu e ka ky, entuziasmohet sa here qe i firmosin cekun dhe merr frymezim, apo nuk kemi shume banka greke ne Shqiperi
Mos ia var me mire, lere te vazhdoje sepse ke per ta pare se si ka per te bere autogol, keshtu e ka gjithone ky. E kam bere prove tek tema mbi Kanunin, kur po e diskutonim bashke me Hyllieni-n dhe e nxorem kete D.S-ne bllof.
Pastaj ta kesh parasysh se e ky D.S eshte mod tek forumi paralel i FSH, dhe i ka vene qellim vetes me duket t'i shkaterroje temat tek FSH, dhe te na bezdise. Tipa te tille me mire meritojne injorim, perderisa nuk vlejne asgje.

[Gordon Freeman]

Flamuri me dy krena ka origjine bizantine dhe kjo eshte e padiskutueshme.





por ka nje problem qe ky flamur i sotem qe mbajme ne nuk i ngjan shume atij te vjetrit sepse "dikush" e ka modifikuar ate

tani ky flamur i sotem gjan me nje flamur i hartuar nga "patriote" te komuniteti bektashinje qe ka per simbol lirine



kurse shqiponja me dy koke nuk ka per simbol lirine ,shikoni stemen e familjes se kastrioteve dhe analizoni dallimet.

[fegi]

1.edhe kjo e ngjajshme me shqiponjen.
2.unaza e mbretreshes Teodora

[Gordon Freeman]

1.edhe kjo e ngjajshme me shqiponjen.
2.unaza e mbretreshes Teodora

kjo shqiponje me ngjan shume me emblemen e kishes orthodoxe shqiptare

[mario_kingu]

te tere e din ate gje ka origjine bizantine

[Dasius]

Cfare??? Pirro Re dell" Albania eshte i kohes se vonshme???
Nuk e dija qe je dhe qorr, sorry.

Thucydides perjashton epirotet nga helenet.

The Hellenic troops with him consisted of the Ambraciots, Leucadians, and Anactorians, and the thousand Peloponnesians with whom he came; the barbarian of a thousand Chaonians, who, belonging to a nation that has no king, were led by Photius and Nicanor, the two members of the royal family to whom the chieftainship for that year had been confided. With the Chaonians came also some Thesprotians, like them without a king, some Molossians and Atintanians led by Sabylinthus, the guardian of king Tharyps who was still a minor, and some Paravaeans, under their King Oroedus, accompanied by a thousand Orestians, subjects of King Antiochus and placed by him under the command of Oroedus. There were also a thousand Macedonians sent by Perdiccas without the knowledge of the Athenians, but they arrived too late.

kurse Appiani i klasifikon epirotet brenda ilireve

The Greeks call those people Illyrians who occupy the region beyond Macedonia and Thrace from Chaonia and Thesprotia to the river Ister (Danube). This is the length of the country. Its breadth is from Macedonia and the mountains of Thrace to Pannonia and the Adriatic and the foot-hills of the Alps. Its breadth is five days' journey and its length thirty -- so the Greek writers say. The Romans measured the country and found its length to be upward of 6000 stades and its width about 1200

PS.shih nje foto tjeter

Foto qe kishe nxjerre me pare ishte nje tjeter jo kjo qe ke nxjerre tani. Megjithate une spo bej vleresime per ty se sia vlen me.

Pike se pari

Ne kohen kur mbreteronte Pirro i Epirit, termi Albania nuk ekzistonte fare po ashtu dhe populli Albanez (Shqiptar). Termi Albania ka hyre ne perdorim gjate kohes se perandorise romake dhe eshte nje term latin.

Pike se dyti

Termi Albania eshte perdorur ne kohera te ndryshme per qellime te ndryshme per te percaktuar nje territor qe perkon pak a shume me trevat e sotshme te shqiptareve por jo gjithmone ne kete percaktim eshte perfshire edhe vete populli Shqiptar. Gjithashtu populli Shqiptar shume here eshte quajtur si Epirot por kjo ka ndodhur kur Epiri nuk ekzistonte me.

Pike se treti

Eshte nje tipar i zakonshem ky i historianeve te lashte qe perdorin terma antik per territore moderne, por kjo nuk duhet marre shabllon. P.sh. Marin Barleti ne vepren e vet per Skenderbeun i quan Shqiptaret Epirote per shkak se banonin ne toka te cilat dikur i perkisnin Epirit dhe Nova Epirus. Mirepo kjo nuk do te thote automatikisht qe Shqiptaret jane Epirote e anasjelltas.

Ne qofte se nje Historian perdor termin Pirro, re dAlbania, ketu duhet pare se nga kush eshte shkruar, per ke eshte shkruar dhe kur eshte shkruar, cilat jane termat e perdorura ne ate kohe specifike e shume faktore te tjere. Ne studimin e historise keto jane gjera te zakonshme. Po te ishte se do te merreshin te gjitha sa shkruhen shabllon atehere me historine do te ishte bere nje lemsh i vertete.

Na del ti me nja dy letra librash e pa pritur na ndrite historine.

Per te sqaruar sa me mire lexo arsyetimin e meposhtem.

Ne kohen e Epirit nuk ekzistonin thame as Shqiptaret, as Albanezet e as Arberit. Ekzistonin popujt Ilire te ndare sipas fiseve te ndryshme.
Epirotet vertete nuk kane qene Helene, por per nga civilizimi i perkisnin botes Helene, ashtu si edhe Maqedonsit e Aleksandrit. Cfare do te thote kjo? Kjo do te thote se jeta e tyre sociale, administrimi i pushtetit dhe struktura e perendive ishte si ajo e Heleneve, nderkohe qe popujt e tjere ballkanike kishin tejeter lloj strukture sociale (fisnore, jo mbreter, aristokraci etj), tjeter lloj organizimi (fshatra dhe qendra te banuara, jo qytete) dhe tjeter sistem perendish (dielli, hena, etj. jo Zeus, Athina, etj.)

Eshte vertetuar tashme (jo definitivisht) se shqiptaret nuk e kane prejardhjen nga Iliret porse nga Daket. Cfare do te thote kjo? Iliret ishin popuj lundruesish. Historia i njeh mire famen e Ilireve si pirate te Adriatikut.

Populli i sotshem Shqiptar nga ana tjeter ne fondin e vet gjuhesor nuk ka asnje fjale te trasheguar nga protoshqipja qe ti perkasi sferes se peshkimit, lundrimit apo cdo gjeje tjeter qe ka lidhje me detin, nderkohe qe ne sfera te tjera, vecanerisht ne ate te blegtorise, kafsheve dhe luleve dominojne fjalet e fondit autokton. Pra, kjo do te thote se populli i sotshem Shqiptar e ka prejardhjen nga nje zone e thell e ballkanit, larg detit. Po te kishte qene Ilir, atehere keto fjale nuk do te kishte nevoje ti huazonte nga latinishjta.

Gjithashtu, dy faktore te tjere deshmojne qe Iliret nuk jane paraardhesit tane. I pari eshte fakti qe ne shqipen e sotshme gjenden shume pak fjale (numerohen me gishta) te Ilirishtes (po aq fjale kane huazuar dhe gjuhet sllave). I dyti eshte fakti qe Shqipja ka shume pak huazime nga Greqishtja e lashte. Kjo tregon se populli Shqiptar ka qene larg botes Helene.

Lind pyetja, cfare i ben studiuesit qe te mendojne se Shqiptaret mund te kene lidhje me daket? Dy faktore kryesore: Shqipja ka rreth 80 fjale te perbashketa me Rumanishten (vendndodhja e dikurshme e Dakeve) qe nuk jane te fondit Indo-Europian dhe qe nuk dihet se nga vijne dhe e dyta, Shqipja e vjeter bashke me Rumanishten mendohet qe te jene gjuhet kryesore qe kane ndikuar ne krijimin e te ashtuquajtures Lidhje Gjuhesore Ballkanike (Balkan Schprachbund).
Kjo do te thote se dikur keto gjuhe kane qene prane njerat tjetres dhe se kane marre e kane dhene me njera tjetren.

Sipas studiuesve sot sundon mendimi qe Shqiptaret e kane zanfillen e tyre ne zonen e Kosoves e me siper, prane dakeve te dikurshem.

A do te thote kjo se ne nuk jemi autoktone te trojeve ne te cilat jetojme sot? Aspak. Populli Shqiptar ka aq shume shekuj qe jeton ne keto troje saqe askush nuk mund tua mohoje autoktonine.

Megjithate ne nuk kemi prejardhje prej Epiroteve.

Ndersa persa i perket Pellasgeve, ne ato shkrimet e tua thuhet se Pellasget ishin populli vendas qe gjendej para se te vinin popujt indo-europiane. Shqipja eshte vertetuar plotesisht qe eshte gjuhe indo-europiane.