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  1. #41
    ja dhe Pema gjenologjike:



  2. #42
    Perjashtuar
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    bamba!.

    kete rruge ndiek edhe Elena Kocaqi ne dy librat e saj.......ajo gjen edhe prejardhjen e shume mbreterive te tjera te evropes.....sipas dijetarve evropian!

  3. #43
    i/e regjistruar Maska e ujkus
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    NE Fakt ka shume te verteta por ajo lufte ishte totalisht ilire dhe nuk kishte te bente me greket .greket vete jane nje kulture e kultivuar nga filozofet dhe te tjere e ardhur nga azia ? por qe shume fise e perqafuan ate per interesat e tyre ,.historikisht na ka interesuar te luftojme sepse kjo eshte menyra qe ne edhe sot e kesaj dite i zgjidhim punet . keshtu qe ajo lufte ish gati thjeshte duheshe nje pretekst .dhe ai u gjet si pretekst nje femer .edhe sot po njesoj .keshtu qe troja apo iliriada ishte nje lufte e pasur mes nje gjaku por qe te tjeret e shkruan.
    greket dhe romaket kane shkruar historine tone ,duhet ti falenderojme per kete por tani kemi nje problem qe duhet ta vertetojme . dhe jo te huajve por vellazvne tane teshkolluar ne shkollat jashte e bbrenda qe kane ne dore fate e venit dhe qe nuk pranojne te fillojne shqperine e re nga historia .

  4. #44
    i/e regjistruar Maska e ujkus
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    e vertete bamba

  5. #45
    i/e larguar Maska e GL_Branch
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    Titus Livius or Livy [Chapters 11-20]

    Preparations were made on both sides with the utmost vigour for a war
    very like a civil one, in a manner between parents and children, both being of Trojan stock: for from Troy came Lavinium, from Lavinium, Alba, and the Romans were descended from the stock of the Alban kings.


    Titus Livius or Livy [Chapters 22-25]


    "Hear, O Jupiter; hear, O pater patratus of the Alban people

  6. #46
    i/e larguar Maska e GL_Branch
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    - Numitor, at the beginning of the fray, giving out that enemies had invaded the city and attacked the palace, after he had drawn off the Alban youth to the citadel to secure it with an armed garrison, when he saw the young men, after they had compassed the king's death, advancing toward him to offer congratulations, immediately summoned a meeting of the people, and recounted his brother's unnatural behaviour toward him, the extraction of his grandchildren, the manner of their birth, bringing up, and recognition, and went on to inform them of the king's death, and that he was responsible for it

    - Indeed, the number of Alban and Latin inhabitants was too great for the city; the shepherds also were included among that population, and all these readily inspired hopes that Alba and Lavinium would be insignificant in comparison with that city, which was intended to be built. But desire of rule, the bane of their grandfather, interrupted these designs, and thence arose a shameful quarrel from a sufficiently amicable beginning.

    - ." Thus Romulus obtained possession of supreme power for himself alone. The city, when built, was called after the name of its founder.[5] He first proceeded to fortify the Palatine Hill, on which he himself had been brought up. He offered sacrifices to Hercules, according to the Grecian rite, as they had been instituted by Evander; to the other gods, according to the Alban rite. There is a tradition that Hercules, having slain Geryon, drove off his oxen, which were of surpassing beauty.

    - It so happened that some Roman and Alban peasants mutually plundered each other's lands. Gaius Cluilius at that time was in power at Alba. From both sides ambassadors were sent almost at the same time, to demand satisfaction. Tullus had ordered his representatives to attend to their instructions before anything else. He knew well that the Alban would refuse, and so war might be proclaimed with a clear conscience. Their commission was executed in a more dilatory manner by the Albans: being courteously and kindly entertained by Tullus, they gladly took advantage of the king's hospitality. Meanwhile the Romans had both been first in demanding satisfaction, and upon the refusal of the Alban, had proclaimed war upon the expiration of thirty days: of this they gave Tullus notice. Thereupon he granted the Alban ambassadors an opportunity of stating with what demands they came. They, ignorant of everything, at first wasted some time in making excuses: That it was with reluctance they would say anything which might be displeasing to Tullus, but they were compelled by orders: that they had come to demand satisfaction: if this was not granted, they were commanded to declare war. To this Tullus made answer, "Go tell your king, that the king of the Romans takes the gods to witness, that, whichever of the two nations shall have first dismissed with contempt the ambassadors demanding satisfaction, from it they [the gods] may exact atonement for the disasters of this war." This message the Albans carried home.

    - Preparations were made on both sides with the utmost vigour for a war very like a civil one, in a manner between parents and children, both being of Trojan stock: for from Troy came Lavinium, from Lavinium, Alba, and the Romans were descended from the stock of the Alban kings

    - The Albans first invaded the Roman territories with a large army. They pitched their camp not more than five miles from the city, and surrounded it with a trench, which, for several ages, was called the Cluilian trench, from the name of the general, till, by lapse of time, the name, as well as the event itself, was forgotten. In that camp Cluilius, the Alban king, died: the Albans created Mettius Fufetius dictator. In the meantime Tullus, exultant, especially at the death of the king, and giving out that the supreme power of the gods, having begun at the head, would take vengeance on the whole Alban nation for this impious war, having passed the enemy's camp in the night-time, marched with a hostile army into the Alban territory.

    - Then the Alban army, which had been a mere spectator of the fight, was marched down into the plains. Mettius congratulated Tullus on his victory over the enemy; Tullus on his part addressed Mettius with courtesy. He ordered the Albans to unite their camp with that of the Romans, which he prayed heaven might prove beneficial to both; and prepared a purificatory sacrifice for the next day. As soon as it was daylight, all things being in readiness, according to custom, he commanded both armies to be summoned to an assembly. The heralds, beginning at the farthest part of the camp, summoned the Albans first.



    Per me teper lexo ketu se eshte shkrim i gjate:
    http://annourbis.com/Livy/Livius-1/10828-8_U14.html

    ose ketu:

    http://thriceholy.net/Texts/Livy1.html
    Ndryshuar pėr herė tė fundit nga GL_Branch : 29-08-2008 mė 06:35

  7. #47
    i/e larguar Maska e GL_Branch
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    Citim Postuar mė parė nga Hyj-Njeriu Lexo Postimin
    Dardanet ne troje e azi te vogel shkuan para frigjeve,prandaj them qe troja nuk eshte frigje...kete e verteton si arkeologjia ashtu edhe herodoti....biles per frigjte D'angely ka hedhur nje barazim gjuhesor shume me vlere

    Breuk-brige-frige

    Breuket ishin fis panon poshte saves ne veri te autariateve,po ashtu briget ishin fis pajon ,pasi maqedonia antike njihej si pajoni,edhe tek iliada e duke qene se pajon=panon mund te themi se friget ishin Breuket panone (afer lumit drina qe ndan serbine me bosnjen) te cilet bashke ose pas dardaneve vershuan ne tokat e azise se vogel ....ne fund te fundit fiset e azise se vogel ishin te gjitha ilire...

    shiko nje moment interesant...Perrebejt ilire banonin ne thesali,poshte olimpit
    e ndodheshin ne radhet e akejve,kurse pajonet qe banonin siper olimpit luftonin ne radhet trojane....

    si te thuash ishte nje lufte mes iliresh te paster 100% nga ana trojane me ilire te cileve u ishte prishur pak gjaku,nga ana akease...
    Eshte e vertete qe eshte pranuar nga ana arkeologjike:


    Late Bronze age 1,400 BC




    The archaeology has shown that the Hallstatt culture and Urnfield cultures of central Europe spread into west Romania and pushed south down the Morava-Vardar valleys into Macedonia. The Glasinac (Illyrian) features moved south into Albania, Epirus and the Greek peninsular. In Romania the Noua culture of Moldavia and Sabatinovka culture continued throughout most of the region.

    "Traditional" history says that in about 1300 BC the Illyrian and Venetic tribes started migrating south from Pannonia to Dalmatia. This caused the Doric tribes to move south and take the Mycenae lands of the Achaeans and in turn the Achaeans moved into the Aegean islands and Asia Minor.


    Transition to Iron age ~1,000BC



    Further cultural movements in the west Balkans and Greece continued after the start of the Iron Age. This was the period of the Dark Age in Greece (Mycenaean IIIC to end of Geometric), the change from the Bronze Age to Iron Age in the Balkans, and the Hallstatt A culture in central Europe.

    The Dardani (Illyrian) caused the Taulantii (Illyrian) to move south in ~10th century to Epirus. The Liburni moved along the Morava-Vardar to Macedonia in ~9th century. The central Illyrian tribes (Glasinac culture) moved into the Lakes region (Pelagonia) and Macedonia ~800BC. This caused a fall in prosperity in Macedonia and possibly the migration of the Phryges to Asia-Minor (if Brygi=Phrygi). This would link the Phryges => Lausitz => Vattina cultures.


    Iron Age
    1000BC-800BC


  8. #48
    i/e regjistruar Maska e Kreksi
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    Mire e the sa iu perkete fiseve ilire ne "Iliada" mirepo sa i perkete themelimit te ketij qyteti me emrin ILIAD vjene nga Ilius, i biri Trojit, Trosit(greqishtė) pra Hili ishte gjyshi i Priamit...ku ne kohen e luftes qe autoret modern e quajten lufta e Trojes ne te vertete duhej te ishte me te drejte "lufta e Hilionit" e jo e trojes...perndryshe Homeri do ta ta quante "trojada" e jo "Iliada" ....
    Gjenealogjia e ketij qyteti eshte kjo;

    Dardani i Madh-erdhi nga dardania e Hilirisė
    I
    Eriktoni
    I
    Trojani(Trosi) nga e merr emrin Troja
    I
    Iliusi, ku ky qytete merr emrin e tij...
    I
    Laomedoni, nipi i trojanit e i ati i Priamit
    I
    Priami, i fundit nga gjenealogjia e dardanideve....

    peonet ishin prezent ne azi ne shek XIII; ?

    Aspake nuke eshte e saket kjo teori qe nuke perputhet me as nje studim...
    Eh, i vetmi studiim qe eshte per tu diskutuar eshte kultura e halstatit ku gjoja se iliret zbriten nga atje per ne jug e qender te ballkanit, keto keramika nuke mund te jene si prov themelore, hipoteza po, por iliret me soguri se jane nje fis pellazg...kjo e sigurt dhe jetonin aty ne ballkan per me se 8000 vite...

    P.S: kjo harat e re qe sollet, aspake e saket; si mund te caktoje dikush kete datim ne shekullin e 8-tė para krishti
    kur dihet se keto fise ilire si dardanet e
    Ndryshuar pėr herė tė fundit nga Kreksi : 30-08-2008 mė 06:33
    Askush nuk te pyt: ē'ka bere atedheu per ty por ē'ke bere ti per Atedheun ! - JFK

  9. #49
    i/e regjistruar Maska e Kreksi
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    Mire e the sa iu perkete fiseve ilire ne "Iliada" mirepo sa i perkete themelimit te ketij qyteti me emrin ILIAD vjene nga Ilius, i biri Trojit, Trosit(greqishtė) pra Hili ishte gjyshi i Priamit...ku ne kohen e luftes qe autoret modern e quajten lufta e Trojes ne te vertete duhej te ishte me te drejte "lufta e Hilionit" e jo e trojes...perndryshe Homeri do ta ta quante "trojada" e jo "Iliada" ....
    Gjenealogjia e ketij qyteti eshte kjo;

    Dardani i Madh-erdhi nga dardania e Hilirisė
    I
    Eriktoni
    I
    Trojani(Trosi) nga e merr emrin Troja
    I
    Iliusi, ku ky qytete merr emrin e tij...
    I
    Laomedoni, nipi i trojanit e i ati i Priamit
    I
    Priami, i fundit nga gjenealogjia e dardanideve....
    Askush nuk te pyt: ē'ka bere atedheu per ty por ē'ke bere ti per Atedheun ! - JFK

  10. #50
    me 40 hajdutė Maska e alibaba
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    Ne shpellen e pirateve
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    Si u bė qė s'gjendet dot njė kafkė dinarike nė varrezat e dardajve e akajve tė atyre zonave?

  11. #51
    i/e regjistruar Maska e Kreksi
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    Citim Postuar mė parė nga alibaba Lexo Postimin
    Si u bė qė s'gjendet dot njė kafkė dinarike nė varrezat e dardajve e akajve tė atyre zonave?
    ...i kanė djegur, nuke kishte varrime por djegje mbi tuf te druve e pastaj hinin e venin ne vaze apo ēypa te mbyllur me dyll; keshtu behej riti atehere te vdekurve...
    Edhe te ne ne tuma jane gjetur plote qypa te tille me hi te te vdekurve....
    Kafka mund te kete diku por jane te rralla....Shlimani i pat gjetur disa por perfunduan ne Berlin....ku ta di une se a egzistojn ende apo jo....
    Askush nuk te pyt: ē'ka bere atedheu per ty por ē'ke bere ti per Atedheun ! - JFK

  12. #52
    me 40 hajdutė Maska e alibaba
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    ...i kanė djegur, nuke kishte varrime por djegje mbi tuf te druve e pastaj hinin e venin ne vaze apo ēypa te mbyllur me dyll; keshtu behej riti atehere te vdekurve...
    Edhe te ne ne tuma jane gjetur plote qypa te tille me hi te te vdekurve....
    Kafka mund te kete diku por jane te rralla....Shlimani i pat gjetur disa por perfunduan ne Berlin....ku ta di une se a egzistojn ende apo jo....
    Tė njėjtin mendim kam edhe unė.
    Vendasit dinarikė praktikonin diegien, i venin monedha nė sy e pastaj i digjnin.

    Kurse ardhacakėt mesdhetarė varroseshin.

  13. #53
    OPENMINDED Maska e land
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    Citim Postuar mė parė nga XH.GASHI Lexo Postimin
    Frigjet -ishin vetem fis Pellasg-Yllir sikur sot qe kemi fisin numerik Shqiptar qe eshte trashegues i emrit te fisit frigjet-brigjet-fisi BERISHE
    Bravo,ja ku na e nxorre kryeministrin pasardhes te Hektorit

  14. #54
    OPENMINDED Maska e land
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    Citim Postuar mė parė nga alfeko sukaraku Lexo Postimin
    bamba!.

    kete rruge ndiek edhe Elena Kocaqi ne dy librat e saj.......ajo gjen edhe prejardhjen e shume mbreterive te tjera te evropes.....sipas dijetarve evropian!
    Aha,bravo Elenagjithe dinastite europiane do kishin mbetur ne injorance te plote

  15. #55
    Citim Postuar mė parė nga XH.GASHI Lexo Postimin
    Frigjet -ishin vetem fis Pellasg-Yllir sikur sot qe kemi fisin numerik Shqiptar qe eshte trashegues i emrit te fisit frigjet-brigjet-fisi BERISHE
    Citim Postuar mė parė nga BANISHED_ Lexo Postimin
    Bravo,ja ku na e nxorre kryeministrin pasardhes te Hektorit
    Ka egzistuar nje mbret Trakas me emrin Berishades, emer qe e mori gjithe fisi i tij:

    Demosthenes “Against Aristocrates 8 -185”

    ἀνάγκη δὲ ἐστὶ πρῶτον ἁπάντων εἰπεῖν καὶ δεῖξαι τί ποτ' ἐστὶ τὸ Χερρόνησον ὑμᾶς ἀσφαλῶς ἔχειν πεποιηκός: διὰ γὰρ τοῦ μαθεῖν τοῦτο καὶ τἀδίκημα σαφῶς ὄψεσθε. ἔστι τοίνυν, ὦ ἄνδρες Ἀθηναῖοι, τοῦτο, τὸ τελευτήσαντος Κότυος Βηρισάδην καὶ Ἀμάδοκον καὶ Κερσοβλέπτην τρεῖς ἀνθ' ἑνὸς γενέσθαι Θρᾴκης βασιλέας: συμβέβηκε γὰρ ἐκ τούτου αὑτοῖς μὲν ἀντιπάλους εἶναι τούτους, ὑμᾶς δ' ὑπέρχεσθαι καὶ θεραπεύειν

    It is essential that at the outset I should explain to you the circumstances to which you owe the secure possession of the Chersonese, for in the light of that knowledge you will get a clear perception of the wrong that has been committed. The circumstances, men of Athens, are these. On the demise of Cotys three persons instead of one became kings of Thrace -Berisades, Amadocus, and Cersobleptes; and the natural result was that they competed with one another and that they all flattered you and courted your favour.
    Mos te harrojme qe trakasit jane popullsi shume e vjeter, dhe bashkekohes se luftes se Trojes. Kjo mund te jete dhe rastesi, por interesante eshte qe dihet qe Dardanet ishin nje perzjerje iliro-trake.
    Ndryshuar pėr herė tė fundit nga dias10 : 22-10-2009 mė 14:46
    e verteta dhe e drejta jane miq me te mire se edhe vete Platoni, miku im

  16. #56
    OPENMINDED Maska e land
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    Po,por cfar kane te bejne Frigjet me Traket!?Frigjet perdornin nje alfabet Fenikas,te gjitha mbishkrimet e tyre ne Anatoli kane mbetur akoma te paperkthyera.
    Sipas Herodotit keta ne fillim jetonin ne veriun Ballkanik me emrin "Brigi" dhe me pas kur u hodhen ne azine e vogel moren emrin "Frigj"
    Ka disa hipoteza qe i lidhin me armenet e sotem.

  17. #57
    Pasioni pėr shkencėn Maska e Erlebnisse
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    Sa mire do ishte qe shteti jone te kishte nje fare mundesie zhvillimi edukimi e hetimesh mbi keto gjera, sepse djepi i kultures ne fund te fundit, nuk permbahet vetem tek Grekerit, por tek popujt autoktone ballkanas, qe sot i shperfytyrojne me lloj lloj sinonimesh te ndyra: ballkanizim/gjakosje/lufte/egersi etj etj me rradhe. Meritojme me teper, e sidomos nga ana jone.
    La vita č bella...

  18. #58
    i/e regjistruar Maska e bamatat
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    "Questi nomi illiri si ritrovano anche in tempi pił recenti, perņ la loro etimologia č rimasta ignota. Nelle opere grandiose di Omero, soprattutto nell’Odissea (versi 500, 501, 507), si legge anche un’espressione come “Gyraien Petren”, che si traduce come “Gurin e gurte:” (la pietra di pietra). Nell’epopea di Omero si racconta che l’eroe Aiace d’Oileo[2] dopo la caduta di Troia, navigando per mare, giunse in un’isola chiamata Guras Petras. Poseidone, il dio dei mari, colpģ con il tridente Aiace e una parte dell’isola sprofondņ assieme al malaugurato navigatore. Secondo il filologo e patriarca Spiro Konda, il nome della suddetta isola era Gur, un nome che ebbe origine molto prima dei navigatori greci. In tempi pił recenti, i navigatori greci hanno chiamato l’isola con il nome Guras Petras, facendo cosģ una tautologia; cosģ questo nome ellenico antichissimo contiene il nome illiro ancora pił antico Gur,"

    Po te veconi nga ky paragraf , vetem faktin qe Aiace duke u kthyer nga Lufta e Trojes , u akostua ne ishullin "Gyraien Petren" sipas Homerit , pra ne ishullin "Gure Guri" ose ne ishullin Kor Kyra (emri i lashte para latin) ose Korfuzi i sotem (i cili nga formimi me shume ishuj qe mezi dalin mbi uje ngjan tamam me nje grumbull guresh), na del si konkluzion se Aiace nuk vinte nga Azia e Vogel , por nga veriu i Kor Kyres (Gur Gures) per tu kthyer ne vendin e tij .
    Kjo per mua do te thote se Trojen mundet ta kerkojme ne veriperendim apo ne perendim te trojeve shqiptare , ne bregdetin e saj ! (gjithmone ne rast se ka patur te njejtin konfiguracion )

  19. #59
    i/e regjistruar Maska e bamatat
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    "Kor Kyra", eshte paster shqip "Gur Gura" . Ne e kemi perpara syve gjithe historine tone . Kam pare shkrime aktuale shqip me shkronja greke te shkruajtura nga "arvanitet" , nga ajo pjese qe beson ose thote se eshte greke . Mu duken interesante dhe ne rast se mesojme te deshifrojme lehtesisht keto tekste (pra t'i lexojme lehtesisht shqip), atehere do te jemi me te afte te lexojme shqipen me shkronja "greke" ne lashtesi .

  20. #60
    i/e regjistruar Maska e bamatat
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    Pretendimi se grekerit kane bere nje tautologji , sic thote autori me siper ne gjuhen italiane , duke thene "Guraien Petren" , pra "gur guri" , nuk eshte e vertete .
    E para - ishullin te tille nuk e kane emertuar grekerit sepse ai ka emer me permbajtje te paster shqip !
    E dyta - Ne rast se ky eshte emertimi origjinal i Homerit , pra "Guraien Petren" tregon se gjuha qe e ka emertuar duke perdorur dy fjale te ndryshme per sendin "gur" , ka qene nje gjuhe qe ka patur ne leksikun e saj edhe fjale te etruskeve , qe e thene me shkurt , si etrusket dhe ata qe banonin ne gadishullin ballkanik ne kohen e Homerit kane qene nje etni dhe flisnin nje gjuha.

    E treta - Ky mendim si me siper , mbeshtetet nga fakti se me vone , pra ne antikitet , por pas Homerit , ishulli merr emertimin Kor Kyra , pra Gure Gura , me permbajtje te njejte si tek homeri , ku fjala Petren eshte zevendesuar me fjalen Gur . Ky emertim eshte rruajtur deri ne ditet tona .

    E katerta - Nuk kemi te bejme me nje tautologji , pasi perseritja e te njejtit emer , eshte bere per shkak te pamjes dhe formimit te ketij ishulli , pra me shume ishuj te tjere te vegjel duke u paraqitur tamam si Gur Gura.

    Ky eshte mendimi im ......

Faqja 3 prej 4 FillimFillim 1234 FunditFundit

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  • Ju nuk mund tė hapni tema tė reja.
  • Ju nuk mund tė postoni nė tema.
  • Ju nuk mund tė bashkėngjitni skedarė.
  • Ju nuk mund tė ndryshoni postimet tuaja.
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